80000 Homeless Children

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  • #39009
    John Boxall
    Participant

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2011/sep/10/benefits-cap-make-children-homeless

    Doesnt look good

    Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery. The blossom is blighted, the leaf is withered, the god of day goes down upon the dreary scene, and—and in short you are for ever floored.

    Wilkins Micawber, Ch12 David Copperfield

    #110554
    Julian Hobson
    Participant

    Perhaps the whole of the HB world needs to start shouting very loudly from the rooftops. I listened to IDS on the Andrew Marr show at the weekend and he repeated the myth once again.

    The issue that is often forgotten (ignored) whenever this is trumpeted as being reasonable is that working people get HB too.

    It is interesting to calculate the annual salary at which HB is withdrawn for a 3 child family living in 4 bed accomodation in London at the new £400 4 bed cap rate. Haven’t gone that far but from the results below (courtesy of “entitled to”) it is considerable.

    These are the real figures that need debating and publicising ! The stuff government talks about when they say £26,000 cap equates to an annual salary of £30+ thousand is rubbish in the extreme.

    I have just calculated the result for:

    £30,000 – £61.50 Tax Credit, £292.10 HB, £47.10 CB (22,981 net earnings, total bens £20,836.40 = £43,817.40 net per annum

    £40,000 – £10.43 Tax credit, £239.03 HB, £47.10 CB (£29,882 net eaernings,total bens £15,421.12 = £45,303.12 net per annum

    £50,000 – £0.00 Tax Credit, £107.23 HB, £47.10 CB (£35,928 net earnings,total bens £8025.16 = £43,953.16 net per annum

    £60,000 – £0.00 Tax Credit, £97.63 HB, £47.10 CB (£41.728 net earnings,total bens £7525.96 = £49,253.96 net per annum

    #110555
    Julian Hobson
    Participant

    missed the most interesting ones:

    £20,000 – £139.91 TC, £6.34 CTB, £327.38 HB, £47.10 CB (16082.04 Net earnings, total bens £27,077.96 = £43,160 net per annum.

    £15,000 – £179.12 Tc, £11.76 CTB, £345.01 HB, £47.10 CB (12632.36 Net earnings, total bens £30,315.48 = £42,947.84 net per annum

    So in this family scenario getting a job of any description is worth around £17,000 a year when the cap comes in !

    #110556
    Julian Hobson
    Participant

    Or £8,85 per hour worked (with 4 weeks holidays) (ish) net of Tax and Insurance

    #110557
    John Boxall
    Participant

    What Rent/CTAX did you use.

    Of course it underlines the insanity of current rent levels that we are paying out benefit to 40% Tax payers!

    Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery. The blossom is blighted, the leaf is withered, the god of day goes down upon the dreary scene, and—and in short you are for ever floored.

    Wilkins Micawber, Ch12 David Copperfield

    #110558
    Julian Hobson
    Participant

    I used the £400 LHA cap and CT of £1500 per annum. Relied entirely on Entitled to calcs of Tax and NI and everything else so could be errors but i have found that calculator very reliable.

    #110559
    Julian Hobson
    Participant

    for completeness I should add same family economically inactive:

    £8175.44 TC, £5509.40 IS, £1500.00 CTB, £20,800 HB, £2449.20 CB = £38,425.40

    #110560
    Julian Hobson
    Participant

    and finally:

    £70,000 per year (1312.48 HB (25.24 per week)) +£2449.20 CB = £47529.04 net earnings + £3761.98 Benefits = £51290.72 net income per year.

    This is perhaps the most bizarre set of calculations i have ever done and unless i have made some mistakes along the way I’m flabergasted !!!!!

    #110567
    Lee Fearon
    Participant

    spokeswoman for the DWP said….: ” There must be a clear incentive to work. No one will be worse off as a result of Universal Credit.”

    Yes. and it really is tiresome the amount of times this drivel is trotted out.

    1. As we all know, the cuts will be completed prior to the introduction of UC.
    2. Workers who currently get Tax Credits and need childcare will be worse off.

    #110574
    DJM
    Participant

    [quote=Julian Hobson]I listened to IDS on the Andrew Marr show at the weekend and he repeated the myth once again.

    [/quote]

    I had to turn the TV off before I threw something at it.

    #110633
    michaelh
    Participant

    The only real incentive to get people back into work are decent wages and jobs – with out this no other incentive is feesible or workable

    I do worry about the spokesperson’s at DWP – either they are totaly deluded or are just telling us nasty tales. I am not sure if I beleive they are that stupid in that they cant see for them selves what kind of mess is ensuing.

    Might be that they are all pretty clueless, or just driven by the desire to save ££££££’s!!!!!

    Guess I will never know….. :~

    #110636
    John Boxall
    Participant

    [quote=michaelh]The only real incentive to get people back into work are decent wages and jobs – with out this no other incentive is feesible or workable

    [/quote]

    Dont forget affordable housing as well………

    Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six, result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery. The blossom is blighted, the leaf is withered, the god of day goes down upon the dreary scene, and—and in short you are for ever floored.

    Wilkins Micawber, Ch12 David Copperfield

    #110639
    michaelh
    Participant

    yes very true John

    #110777
    Anonymous
    Guest

    [quote=michaelh]
    I do worry about the spokesperson’s at DWP – either they are totaly deluded or are just telling us nasty tales. I am not sure if I beleive they are that stupid in that they cant see for them selves what kind of mess is ensuing.Might be that they are all pretty clueless, or just driven by the desire to save ££££££’s!!!!!

    [/quote]

    Let’s not be too harsh towards individuals and remember that staff at DWP work for the Government of the day whoever that might be. In public they have to adhere to the official line regardless of what their personal views might be. Everyone has a job to do. :love:

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