Terms & Conditions

[Clare Easson]

Here’s an example, what would you do?

Customer goes into hospital 5 Dec 2005, AA will end 4 weeks after this.
We find out about this 19 Dec 05 and notify the pesion service.

Would you at this time key the hospital status from 5/12/05 and end AA status from 1/1/06 or wait for further information to come back from the pension service before making changes?

She has a ND living wth her.

Thanks 😉

[andyrichards]

If it is Guarantee Credit, I don’t think you should (or need to) do anything until such time as you hear from the Pension Service.

In any case I am not sure that anything has happened that would affect HB/CTB entitlement.

The only proviso (assuming that clmt is still in hospital) is that there is an intention to return to the normal home within the 52 weeks from when she first went in. If that is not that case then HB/CTB should be stopped without waiting for the Pension Service.

[Clare Easson]

In this case it would make a difference as there is a Non Dep living there. When AA is in payment there is no ND deduction however when AA ends, we should be taking a ND deduction.

[andyrichards]

Sorry, I knew I’d miss something!

If it is clear that AA has ceased, I would guess that you need to start up the NDD.

[Andy Thurman]

Thought I’d found a way round this – Sched 3 Part 3 (14) allows the SDP to continue by treating the clmt as still in receipt of AA in similar circs (i.e. hosp stay over 28 days). Unfortunately, this is only relevant for the SDP and no similar provision appears to exist for your scenario – another oversight? 🙄
So, I think you are stuck with removing AA & applying deductions. Could go down the DHP route I suppose?

But hang on a minute 8)
❓ Just a thought ❓ Reg 69 (10)(b)(ii) “a change of circumstances in respect of a non-dep”. Could it be argued that the circs [i:033cc411c9]in respect[/i:033cc411c9] of the non-dep have changed (previously they resided with someone in receipt of AA but they don’t any more!) and that the amount of the deduction to be calculated under Reg 55 has increased (from NIL to whichever rate)? This would allow 26 week easement to apply.

[Clare Easson]

We were not sure in this case as we thought generally we were bound NOT to act on pensioner changes until we get word back from TPS (ie we felt her PCGC might reduce to PCSC following the withdrawal of AA)(or an ETD might be received showing the “04” code no longer being displayed against the Non-dep).

Do you know specifically what we can amend from info passed directly to us by the claimant, and what we can’t touch until notified by TPS ? Or point me in the direction of the relevant regulations that might clarify it for me?

[Andy Thurman]

Sorry Clare – think I missed your key point!

HB(SPC) Reg 60 (3) deals with reduction in PC that also reduces HB. So, as PS told in time of the change, should fall to be assessed under (b)(i) of this reg – Monday after PS advise of the change.

The only circs I know of where we can jump ahead of PS decision is capital over £16k (where AIP in place). Until PS tell you otherwise, AA should be treated as being in payment.

[arenton]

Hello Andy,

I think the problem in a case like this is that really there will be no real change to the Pension Credit- so will the Pension Service actually send us any kind of notification?

As the pensioner has a non-dependant, and has AA, it is unlikely that they will have a Severely Disabled Premium in their PC entitlement. So taking away their AA will have no effect on the PC? They are likely still to get their PCGC as normal.

Will TPS send us an ETD which will just take off the “04” indicator telling us no ND Deduction should apply? If they dont- is it our responsibilty to chase them up and insist they do so?

Do we have any kind of free hand to amend claims in these circumstances where in effect there is no real change to the Pension Credit- but potentially a big effect on the HB/CTB claim?

You could change it round and say- what would we do if a pensioner reported that their Non-Dep had become a student. In a case like that- would we have to inform TPS, and wait to get an ETD which showed the non-dep and an “04” code?? (Before amending their HB/CTB claim)

I suppose i am asking- where changes will have no effect on the amount of pension credit in payment- can we process them under normal change of circs rules, rather than waiting on notification from TPS?

ie in the example given, treat the change as a change affecting the non-dep (no longer living with Person on AA)(as suggested earlier) and key without waiting on any word from TPS.

[andyrichards]

My training notes on PC (taken from the PC Manual) suggest that changes of circs which [b:da546ae4d4]only[/b:da546ae4d4] affect HB/CTB are supposed to be reported to the LA rather than the Pension Service. This of course does rather assume that the pensioner is going to be able to work out the fine distinction between a change that affects all their benefits and a change that will only affect HB/CTB. Given that I managed to forget the significance of AA in the application of a NDD earlier on in this thread, how is a claimant meant to know?!

The backup is meant to be that if the PS gets notified of a change which is of no interest to them but which might affect HB/CTB (e.g. rent incease, or ND change) they [b:da546ae4d4]might[/b:da546ae4d4] pass the info on using a form called PC17. But my understanding is that we do not pass a “HB/CTB-only” change to the PS and wait for them to issue a new ETD, because in most cases, they won’t! We should action these sorts of changes as and when we become aware of them in the normal way.

[Anonymous]

[quote:a8e73b133f=”Andy Thurman”]

But hang on a minute 8)
❓ Just a thought ❓ Reg 69 (10)(b)(ii) “a change of circumstances in respect of a non-dep”. Could it be argued that the circs [i:a8e73b133f]in respect[/i:a8e73b133f] of the non-dep have changed (previously they resided with someone in receipt of AA but they don’t any more!) and that the amount of the deduction to be calculated under Reg 55 has increased (from NIL to whichever rate)? This would allow 26 week easement to apply.[/quote:a8e73b133f]

i believe the deduction delay wouldnt apply as this cant be counted as a change in non dep circs (unless perhaps they were the carer for this person, and as the person is in hospital the non dep’s circumstances have now changed (hmmmm….managing to confuse myself 🙄 )
best thing would be to start taking the deduction – better this way than ending up with an overpayment and going down the route of LA error
if unsure about whether or not att allowance has stopped check your RAT terminal

[Author]

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